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An ‘after the wrench’ report
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An ‘after the wrench’ report - February 4, 2006, 10:37 PM

Since there are ‘after the ride’ reports, I thought I would try my hand at an ‘after the wrench’ report. So without further ado….

A little background -
I moved out of the last place I was staying at the end of November (thus losing my beloved 2-car garage). The new place offered 5’x8’ storage units and 1-car garages. I figured I would save a little money by seeing if I could get the 5’x8’ unit to work for the bike.

Well, it did work – but it would take about 30 minutes to pull the 10,000+ pieces of tools, crap, etc out from the sides of the bike to get it in and out. Not to mention having to drag the back wheel around a couple of times to make it turn in a radius of about 5 feet to line up to a ramp to get off of the 6” curb….all while on a slight downhill grade.

Since I knew I wouldn’t have the time to get the bike out much during the winter months, I decided to go ahead and do some basic winterizing stuff by pulling out the battery, adding some Stabil, changing the oil, etc.

So this brings us to today -
After the 5th 60-degree day I missed, I finally decided it was time to go ahead and get a garage for the spring and moved my bike to its new home.

After getting all the junk organized in the garage, I decided to go ahead and put the battery back in and fire it up. Well, I got the first part fine – but the second proved to be a bit more challenging. :-X

The engine would turn over, but it wouldn’t catch – it didn’t even sound like it was trying to catch. After reading this thread a few weeks ago (Diagnosis of bike not turning over?, I immediately worried about hydrolock. I’ve heard of vaporlock before (back home we often used ether to start our tractors, from what I was taught - if you stopped cranking it after spraying the ether it could enter vaporlock. You could tell from the knocking of the engine). Although I understand what hydrolock is, I’m not that familiar with the causes. So I decided it was better to be safe than to be sorry.

I pulled BACK off the tank (thanks to Kawi for putting the battery under the tank) and removed the airbox (cleaned out the filter a bit while I was in there).

Through the throttle bodies I could see the intake valves, so I hit the starter again and sure enough the crank was turning fine. I figured the next place to search would be the plugs, so I pulled those out and everything looked good (less than 6k miles on them, so I didn’t expect a problem there).

At this point I was a bit stumped. I figured since the crank is turning, the only harm I could do by giving the starter another go is a drained battery. I put the plugs back in, reattached the coils, put the airbox back on, grabbed the tank from the corner of the garage and connected the fuel line back up.

Time for the moment of truth….hit the starter……..not catching. I grabbed the throttle and made quick movements from wide open to close and after the 3rd time – there was a hint it was going to catch!

I kept doing that and eventually it almost got started! I did my best to keep the rpms low without letting it cut off. After about 3 or 4 reps of this, it finally stayed running at a low idle. I let it run until it reached operating temperature and cut it off.

I finished off the day by putting it completely back together and now all is well.

So, any ideas on the problem?

When I added the Stabil, I had an almost empty tank, added the Stabil, and then filled up. After gassing up, I let the bike run for about 20~30 minutes before cutting it off to make sure the Stabil got all the way through the system. Could the fuel in the lines have gone bad over the last two months even with the Stabil? That is the only explanation I could come up with. What do you think?
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February 5, 2006, 04:32 PM

I think don't worry about it unless it's still hard to start a couple days from now. Fuel doesn't go bad in two months even without stabilizer, but my Bandit always takes about 8 tries to start after sitting for that long, with or without stabilizer in the tank. It's just like what you described. First couple tries it seems like it's cranking without even trying to catch. Then it sputters a little bit, then runs for a few seconds and quits, then finally it catches and idles.
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February 5, 2006, 09:39 PM

when you guys are saying "catch" do you mean "fire"? If I am trying to start something and I think of it not catching, I think of the starter gear not engaging the flywheel. Fuel can go bad in 2 months. Especially hightest.
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February 5, 2006, 09:47 PM

I call 'catching' as the starter turning the crank but the engine will not even hint at 'firing' as you said.

What would it sound like if the starter gear was not engaging the flywheel? I don't think I've ever heard that before.

And I was using 93 octane with Stabil. I rode it some today with the same fuel and it ran fine all day. Could Stabil work on fuel in the tank but not fuel in the line (because of the smaller storage size)?
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February 5, 2006, 10:06 PM

a starter not engaging would sound like just an electric motor.

If you put stabil in your tank and didn't run it, it would not treat the fuel in fuel injection rail. Next time you try to start it, turn the key on and let the rail pressurize for a few seconds. After you've waited a few seconds, hit the starter but for no more than 5 seconds or so. Try opening the throttle wide open and hit the starter button. If it starts up then, you may need a Throttle Position Sensor adjustment.
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February 5, 2006, 10:08 PM

oh..and I won't start it and let it run unless you are intending to ride it. Letting it sit and idle for extended periods of time is bad for the bike.
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February 6, 2006, 08:11 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scot
a starter not engaging would sound like just an electric motor.

If you put stabil in your tank and didn't run it, it would not treat the fuel in fuel injection rail. Next time you try to start it, turn the key on and let the rail pressurize for a few seconds. After you've waited a few seconds, hit the starter but for no more than 5 seconds or so. Try opening the throttle wide open and hit the starter button. If it starts up then, you may need a Throttle Position Sensor adjustment.
After I put the Stabil in, I ran it for about 30 minutes. Is that not long enough to get Stabil all the way into the fuel rail?

It starts fine now, just like the way it used to. And my throttle position sensor is fine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scot
oh..and I won't start it and let it run unless you are intending to ride it. Letting it sit and idle for extended periods of time is bad for the bike.
I'll be riding it at least once a week from here on out, so that shouldn't be a problem.

Thanks for the help.
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February 6, 2006, 08:45 AM

Maybe it would have started better if you had changed you avitar!


CFIGixx600 has the fastest Gixxer ever made! Go on, ask him about it!
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February 6, 2006, 08:47 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by 100LL
Maybe it would have started better if you had changed you avitar!
Damn my racist bike and its anti-frog ways.
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February 6, 2006, 09:26 AM

Glad you got it to start because you were in such a BAD MOOD!!!


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February 6, 2006, 12:43 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninja636
Damn my racist bike and its anti-frog ways.



SV650s for SALE!!!
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February 8, 2006, 06:57 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninja636
I call 'catching' as the starter turning the crank but the engine will not even hint at 'firing' as you said.

What would it sound like if the starter gear was not engaging the flywheel? I don't think I've ever heard that before.

And I was using 93 octane with Stabil. I rode it some today with the same fuel and it ran fine all day. Could Stabil work on fuel in the tank but not fuel in the line (because of the smaller storage size)?
I've only ever encountered a starter not engaging on an airplane. And Scot is right, it sounds just like an electric motor. In an airplane, when the starter connects, the prop begins to turn...When it doesn't, the prop doesn't turn and all you hear is a high pitched "bzzzzzzzzzzzzz" of the starter turning.

Not sure what this added to the thread except a +1 to my post count. Oh well.


Ninja636 says:
yes, dick is fun!
Ninja636 says:
OH WAIT....
Ninja636 says:
MAYBE I SHOULD REPHRASE THAT

LaoTzu: "I'll just let everyone know, Glade sprayed up the azz burns!"

(While Climbing, talking about his chalk bag)
Matt - "I like it around back where it hits me on the butt while I'm climbing. It's like 'Oooooh, what was that?'"
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February 8, 2006, 06:58 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by 100LL
Maybe it would have started better if you had changed you avitar!
Where the heck have you been??? I haven't heard from you in a long time....I was starting to get worried... <insert hug here>


Ninja636 says:
yes, dick is fun!
Ninja636 says:
OH WAIT....
Ninja636 says:
MAYBE I SHOULD REPHRASE THAT

LaoTzu: "I'll just let everyone know, Glade sprayed up the azz burns!"

(While Climbing, talking about his chalk bag)
Matt - "I like it around back where it hits me on the butt while I'm climbing. It's like 'Oooooh, what was that?'"
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whoa preppy......
 
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February 8, 2006, 07:31 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninja636
After I put the Stabil in, I ran it for about 30 minutes. Is that not long enough to get Stabil all the way into the fuel rail?

It starts fine now, just like the way it used to. And my throttle position sensor is fine.



I'll be riding it at least once a week from here on out, so that shouldn't be a problem.

Thanks for the help.

Good on you for taking the initiative to try and diagnose your own problems. That's the only way you'll learn.


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February 8, 2006, 10:15 AM

Who let this newb work on his bike alone??? He's liable to lose a hand.


SV650s for SALE!!!
- 2007 SV650 Racebike-Superbike KWS/Thermosman suspension/Swenz bodywork/All GSXR Parts
- 2009 SV650 Streetbike Race blue with white stripe/No wrecks/fully faired with M4 full system

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