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Iraq rescinds into tribal war groups
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DT
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Post Iraq rescinds into tribal war groups - March 15, 2006, 01:24 PM

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsAr...AQ-SHIITES.xml

Just the beginning, but expected. This movement is not a bad one either, it will force the terrorists to think twice about attacking Iraqi towns and townspeople... Only downside is whomever is holding the reigns to these new armed parties have little armed militias at their disposal. With the rising hatred between Shi'ite and Sunni Muslims, this could be disasterous for U.S. troops - i.e., the whole country is armed and trigger happy... It will be interesting to see the outcome in the next year. My only prayer is that it's not a bloody one for our troops.


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March 15, 2006, 01:32 PM

Anarchy, the disemination of a people into smaller groups in order so assure personal security. I hoped and didn't think it would happen with the elections, this is really bad. Really bad.


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March 15, 2006, 01:36 PM

they are slowly turning into Afghanistan, and will need a leader respected by all to bring them together like Hamid Karzai did in Afghanistan.


The East Coast Kid


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March 15, 2006, 01:38 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by gixrben
Anarchy, the disemination of a people into smaller groups in order so assure personal security. I hoped and didn't think it would happen with the elections, this is really bad. Really bad.
It is bad - but expected. The Middle Easterners are a Tribal People by nature and unless there is a dictatorship forcing allegiance, they divide themselves accordingly by family and family support. No one can beat it and the concept of democracy is irrelevant to such people.


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March 15, 2006, 02:13 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by DT
It is bad - but expected. The Middle Easterners are a Tribal People by nature and unless there is a dictatorship forcing allegiance, they divide themselves accordingly by family and family support. No one can beat it and the concept of democracy is irrelevant to such people.
Everyone is "tribal" by nature, but our culture discourages it so it has been repressed from most "civilized" cultures. The problem is that thier culture only understands power, not persuasion. How do you undo thousands of years of societal conditioning? Education. But we can't educate with bombs and guns.

This is the natural order of things and should be allowed to play out, but this also means we will be in Iraq for a very long time... I feel a draft, or perhaps THE draft... increased security, patriot acts destroying the freedoms they protect, many more deaths during an occupation for stability. This is not the world I want a child to come into.

No one thinks about plans to scale DOWN... no one.


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March 15, 2006, 02:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by gixrben
Everyone is "tribal" by nature, but our culture discourages it so it has been repressed from most "civilized" cultures. The problem is that thier culture only understands power, not persuasion. How do you undo thousands of years of societal conditioning? Education. But we can't educate with bombs and guns.

This is the natural order of things and should be allowed to play out, but this also means we will be in Iraq for a very long time... I feel a draft, or perhaps THE draft... increased security, patriot acts destroying the freedoms they protect, many more deaths during an occupation for stability. This is not the world I want a child to come into.

No one thinks about plans to scale DOWN... no one.

Well said. Most large scale countries REQUIRE a mandatory military service upon high-school or equivalent education graduation. The U.S. has managed to avoid this so-far but due to our growing need to "show-force" this has to change. There's many reasons beyond what you're saying but that's another discussion for another time!!!


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March 15, 2006, 02:30 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by DT
Well said. Most large scale countries REQUIRE a mandatory military service upon high-school or equivalent education graduation. The U.S. has managed to avoid this so-far but due to our growing need to "show-force" this has to change. There's many reasons beyond what you're saying but that's another discussion for another time!!!
if only these problems didn't stem from a thousand others... grab your britches everybody... here come the world police.

Military societies have universally been undone by themselves...


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Last edited by B; March 15, 2006 at 02:32 PM..
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March 15, 2006, 02:55 PM

i whole heartedly agree with mandatory 2 year term of service right out of highschool. it would straighten out a lot of the ignorant people we have in the U.S. and by ignorant i mean racist, gang oriented, things of that nature. the military really teaches you tolerance for others. not 2 years just to further an occupation of a country, but to better our nation as a whole.

and we are not the only "world police", any where we have american troops, you will always find British, German, and Korean troops right there with us, their numbers may be smaller, but so are the populations of their countries and military.


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March 15, 2006, 02:59 PM

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Originally Posted by eck226
and we are not the only "world police", any where we have american troops, you will always find British, German, and Korean troops right there with us, their numbers may be smaller, but so are the populations of their countries and military.
Who's flags get burned during riots, after a bunch of brits beat the hell out of civilians?

'Nuff said.


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March 15, 2006, 03:04 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by eck226
i whole heartedly agree with mandatory 2 year term of service right out of highschool. it would straighten out a lot of the ignorant people we have in the U.S. and by ignorant i mean racist, gang oriented, things of that nature. the military really teaches you tolerance for others. not 2 years just to further an occupation of a country, but to better our nation as a whole.
Oh yea, because putting people in a situation where their lives are dependent on people who don't want to be there is a good idea.

"Hippy, this is ECK226. When the shit hits the fan, you're expected to fight side by side with him. ECK, don't be surprised when you get shot in the back because Hippy here was hiding in a foxhole while yelling how great the French are because they don't get involved in foreign politics, if you exclude their position as one of the top 5 arms dealers in the world and their constant fucking up of Africa. Anyway, best of luck soldier!"
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March 15, 2006, 03:07 PM

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Originally Posted by stevegula
Oh yea, because putting people in a situation where their lives are dependent on people who don't want to be there is a good idea.

"Hippy, this is ECK226. When the shit hits the fan, you're expected to fight side by side with him. ECK, don't be surprised when you get shot in the back because Hippy here was hiding in a foxhole while yelling how great the French are because they don't get involved in foreign politics, if you exclude their position as one of the top 5 arms dealers in the world and their constant fucking up of Africa. Anyway, best of luck soldier!"
I especially loved the anti-France plug... good work Steve.


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March 15, 2006, 03:12 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevegula
Oh yea, because putting people in a situation where their lives are dependent on people who don't want to be there is a good idea.

"Hippy, this is ECK226. When the shit hits the fan, you're expected to fight side by side with him. ECK, don't be surprised when you get shot in the back because Hippy here was hiding in a foxhole while yelling how great the French are because they don't get involved in foreign politics, if you exclude their position as one of the top 5 arms dealers in the world and their constant fucking up of Africa. Anyway, best of luck soldier!"

thats the reality of it. if he doesnt want to die, then he needs to do his job, if he runs, he'll be shot by them, or possibly by us (but not on purpose, of course). and if he does live, he's a traitor and treated like one. you want to live in this country, and enjoy your freedom to protest it's government, have the balls to stand and defend that freedom from those that threaten it. who knows, he may end up liking it, i know a bunch of self proclaimed hippies that are lifers.

joining the military isnt all war and death, i got to see most of centeral and south america not once putting on my BDU's, i was in suits, or jeans and t-shirt. i was still protecting the U.S. by doing counter drug mission, and i was protecting small children by doing de-mining missions. im sure any hippie could get with the program and find his niche.


*side note- not saying "you" in any of this as directed to an individual, its a nation wide you


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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossi
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March 15, 2006, 03:28 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by eck226
thats the reality of it. if he doesnt want to die, then he needs to do his job, if he runs, he'll be shot by them, or possibly by us (but not on purpose, of course). and if he does live, he's a traitor and treated like one. you want to live in this country, and enjoy your freedom to protest it's government, have the balls to stand and defend that freedom from those that threaten it. who knows, he may end up liking it, i know a bunch of self proclaimed hippies that are lifers.
You missed the entire point. A person who wants to be in the military could die because of someone who does not want to be in the military will fail to do their job.
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March 15, 2006, 03:37 PM

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You missed the entire point. A person who wants to be in the military could die because of someone who does not want to be in the military will fail to do their job.
if hippie bob doesnt want to be in the US military, maybe hippie bob shouldnt be a US citizen. its like many other things, people demand and expect certain things, but dont want to pay for them.

and for military joe who hippie bob leaves in the fox hole-

by joining the military in any incarnation the increased chances death is something you were aware of from day 1. you joined with the understanding that you are a Soldier (Marine, Airman, Seaman) from day one, and your first job in the military is a rifleman. if you think other wise you were wrong and will pay for it.

that is a bonus of volunteering, you get to pick what you do. if a draft happens and you are called, it would be best for you to run down and volunteer so you have a choice to be a graphic designer, telivision camera man, you dont and you are and 11B, infantry grunt. take your pick.


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March 15, 2006, 03:51 PM

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Originally Posted by eck226
if hippie bob doesnt want to be in the US military, maybe hippie bob shouldnt be a US citizen. its like many other things, people demand and expect certain things, but dont want to pay for them.
Maybe it's Hippy Bob that keeps you from living in an authoritarian dictatorship and instead in an almost-authoritarian-dictatorship where you still have a few rights and you should thank him just as much as you expect him to thank you. What you expect and demand are entirely different from what Hippy Bob expects and demands. And while our military is off fighting foreign enemies, realize that hippy bob is about the only one left fighting domestic enemies.

*edit* And Boomie better read this damn post and pat me on the back... or front... in my pants. whatever she prefers because I'm a gentleman like that.
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