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No Knock Search Warrants - How Do You Feel About Them?
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No Knock Search Warrants - How Do You Feel About Them? - February 14, 2011, 05:34 PM

This is about 3rd or 4th time in the past 12 months that I've read about LEO's using a so called "No-Knock Search Warrant" to bust into someone's house in the middle of the night/early in the morning, startling a family or home member, and then in return an officer guns them down. The most recent one that comes to mind is in Detroit where they tossed a flash bang on a little 7 year old girl and lit her fire, and jumping up burning and officer shot her dead.

In this case, the officers recognized at worst, what he had in his hand was a sword and he was not attacking but standing 20 ft away.

Then they shot him 3 times and then yelled, "get on the ground?" - Huh? Backwards say you?

I know in many less than ideal neighborhoods, it's a common ploy for home invaders to pretend like they're police serving a search warrant to gain access. And I am quite sure any police officer familiar with the neighborhood would know this as well.

Anyway, the cops found a whopping "small amount of pot and an empty vial that likely contained meth."
So a man was murdered in his own home over the equivalent of a personal use misdemeanor.





Your thoughts?



Dressed in black and carrying assault rifles, members of a local multi-jurisdiction police unit burst into a dark home in Ogden, Utah, one night in September shouting, "Police! Search warrant!"

A video of the incident made by the Weber-Morgan counties Narcotics Strike Force and the federal Drug Enforcement Agency shows a man suddenly appearing in a hallway holding a shiny object that an officer thought was a sword, but was really a golf club, according to Weber County Attorney Dee Smith.

In the instant he appeared, the video shows, three shots rang out and the man, Todd Blair, 45, fell to the floor, dead.

The Ogden incident was among a growing number of no-knock police raids last year, a tactic that has grown in use from 2,000 to 3,000 raids a year in the mid-1980s, to 70,000 to 80,000 annually, says Peter Kraska, a professor of criminal justice at Eastern Kentucky University who tracks the issue.

That increase has raised questions about the tactic, including whether the surprise element poses an unnecessary threat to people whose residences are invaded.

Judges can issue no-knock warrants when they believe the element of surprise could help officers avoid danger or keep people from destroying evidence, Kraska says.

Critics say the no-knock tactic gives residents — some innocent — seconds to decide if they face a police raid or a home invasion.

At times, particularly in drug cases, police make their case for no-knock search warrants based on faulty information from unreliable informants, says Ezekiel Edwards, an attorney for the American Civil Liberties Union.

"That's just going to increase invasions of privacy and tragic harm to both residents and officers," he says.

In the Odgen incident, Sgt. Troy Burnett was found to have handled the situation appropriately, Smith says. "This was a split-second decision. He acted according to his training."

Arlean Blair, mother of the man who was shot, says her son posed no threat to officers. "They could have used rubber bullets. They could have used spray," she says.

Bill Johnson, executive director of the National Association of Police Organizations, says the onus for the increase in no-knock cases is on the judges who authorize such warrants.

The law holds that police should knock and announce themselves, except in special circumstances and when they have approval from a magistrate, says Miller Shealy, assistant law professor at the Charleston School of Law in South Carolina.

They don't need a no-knock warrant if changing circumstances give them reason to barge in, he says.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/...ck14_ST_N.htm#



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February 14, 2011, 05:37 PM

Robbers using the Police Search Warrant trick.

BEDFORD ---- Two robbers disguised as cops raided a home in Bedford Friday and handcuffed the homeowner before fleeing with cash, police said.

The men were wearing black T-shirts with "POLICE" written on both sides. They had two fake badges and two air pistols.

The robbers handcuffed the homeowner in front of his two small children. Before fleeing the house, they removed the handcuffs and put plastic bands around the homeowner's wrists, police said. Neighbors spotted the robbers and gave police a description of the vehicle.

A Bedford detective spotted the car on Rockside Road. Another officer and the detective cornered the car and forced it to stop. Police captured one suspect, but the other ran to St. Monica School in Garfield Heights.

Officers from Garfield Heights, Maple Heights and Walton Hills assisted in the search. The second suspect hid in the school but was arrested when he tried to flee the building. Charges are pending, police said.
http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2009...as_police.html

================================================== =================

PHOENIX -- For the second time this week, armed men dressed in police raid uniforms stormed a local house, authorities said.

The most recent incident occurred Thursday night near 69th Avenue and Thomas, police said. Officials also said there were between four and 10 men armed with handguns.

According to police, the robbers, wearing police raid shirts and baseball caps, raided the home and held two men captive for about 10 minutes while robbing the victims of their money and other items. One of the victims was pistol-whipped, but not hurt badly, authorities said. No shots were fired.

On Sunday, six men dressed in full SWAT regalia with assault rifles fired more than 100 rounds of ammunition at another home in the west valley, officials said. One man was killed in the raid.
Robbers Dressed As Police Storm Home - Phoenix News Story - KPHO Phoenix



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February 14, 2011, 06:00 PM

If you're doing shyt that would require a search warrant in the first place, you have no right to complain. Stop breaking the law and maybe the law will stop knocking at your door (pun intended.)
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February 14, 2011, 06:03 PM

I think the major concern is no-knock warrants being executed against the wrong address and persons who were in no way involved.


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February 14, 2011, 06:04 PM

"Robbers using the Police Search Warrant trick" doesnt happen as much as people think it does. Actually, not even close. But I do hear that excuse all the time. But when I ask that same person do they know someone in the neighborhood who that has happened to? I get the same response.."Well..I heard...or my boy heard..blah blah blah." Although it does happen. No knock warrants - I think its necessary. On the flip side of this, how many search warrants where weapons are recovered within hands reach of a suspect the police got the jump on? You know how many times on a search warant, the police yell..."Police Get on the ground and people STILL come at them with a weapon (and yes, a golf club can be used as a weapon). Thats why I am a bog proponent of less than lethal weapons (tazers, rubber rounds, bean bags, etc.) I wonder how many search warrants are done a day incident free.

Also, a lot of places are really strict on issuing out those types of warrants. I mean jsut saying they are going to destroy evidence usually doesnt fly. usually, these guys are armed, have attempted to kill someone, actually killed someone, or made it clear that they are not going to jail and will go out in a blaze of glory, etc. Not usually for "small amount of pot and an empty vial that likely contained meth."


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February 14, 2011, 06:05 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stillie View Post
I think the major concern is no-knock warrants being executed against the wrong address and persons who were in no way involved.
Exactly - thats why when someone is applying for a warrant, at least around here, they are a TON of questions the judges ask about the location before they even issue out the warrant..


I forgot to add - a lot of times, suspects mouths get them in a lot of trouble..People start showing off to the whole block..spouting off.."I aint going down like that!" or "No MFers are taking my shit..I got something for em!" - Pistol whipping everyone on the block...etc..Well, heres a news flash for them...if you say that kinda crap, DONT BE SUPRISED IF YOUR DOOR GETS TAKEN OFF THE HINGES BY A BIG GYAT DAMN RAM.


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February 14, 2011, 06:10 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scorpion9R View Post
Exactly - thats why when someone is applying for a warrant, at least around here, they are a TON of questions the judges ask about the location before they even issue out the warrant..
They don't mess up?

Did I miss the press release where human being, police certainly being human (unless they are being handled by other police), are infallible.

Didn't they raid the wrong address in MD?

Not trying to bust your balls specifically James but warrants like this are crap. If you are worried about people getting out, surround the joint. If you are worried about firefights, you would be better served behind the cover of your vehicle.
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February 14, 2011, 06:18 PM

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They don't mess up?

Did I miss the press release where human being, police certainly being human (unless they are being handled by other police), are infallible.

Didn't they raid the wrong address in MD?

Not trying to bust your balls specifically James but warrants like this are crap. If you are worried about people getting out, surround the joint. If you are worried about firefights, you would be better served behind the cover of your vehicle.
Not bustin my balls..Mistakes do happen - what I am saying is that they are very rare and no-knock warrants have their place. Not every warrant is or should be a no-knock warrant. No-knock warrants are not easy to get. Im not worried about people getting out..thats why there are a ton of officers assigned to be outside. But some people bring the pain upon themselves...


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February 14, 2011, 06:24 PM

I hear what you guys are saying, but put yourself in their shoes. They don't know what they're walking into. For all they know, they're walking into a situation where someone's got a gun under their pillow and will take 'em down without a second thought. Shyt, if it were me, I'd make sure I get to go home at the end of the night.
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February 14, 2011, 06:32 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackHatch

Didn't they raid the wrong address in MD?
.
Are you talking about the one where they raided the mayor's house and shot one of his dogs over a marijuana package?

That was the right address.


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February 14, 2011, 06:50 PM

I guess they are necessary evils but things could get real hairy if they bust into the wrong house, or even a house they might have thought contained drugs for example, and were met with gun fire. Who is guilty if a cop is killed or a member of the household and there is not one illegal thing in the house? I understand cops identify themselves but if you're caught up in the moment, especially after being woken up like that, draw out your pistol and start shooting, what happens??


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February 14, 2011, 06:54 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by CantGetCaught View Post
If you're doing shyt that would require a search warrant in the first place, you have no right to complain. Stop breaking the law and maybe the law will stop knocking at your door (pun intended.)
See the answer below CGC.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stillie View Post
I think the major concern is no-knock warrants being executed against the wrong address and persons who were in no way involved.
There are often times when these No Knock Warrants are being predicated on snitches who they may 'believe' is involved in criminal activity aka dry snitching.

Or, you may be living in a house and not know your cousin/brother/son is a small time drug dealer. Maybe moving about a few ounces or so of whatever a month.

I mean don't get me wrong, there are clearly times when No Knocks are appropriate and warranted but everytime I read about someone being shot and killed in one of these, it's most often some suburban residential spot and either the person being sought is not there, nothing is found, or such a minimal amount of whatever substance - it was clearly personal use and wouldn't have amounted to more than a small fine in court.



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February 14, 2011, 07:02 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by turkishexpress View Post
I guess they are necessary evils but things could get real hairy if they bust into the wrong house, or even a house they might have thought contained drugs for example, and were met with gun fire. Who is guilty if a cop is killed or a member of the household and there is not one illegal thing in the house? I understand cops identify themselves but if you're caught up in the moment, especially after being woken up like that, draw out your pistol and start shooting, what happens??
That's what gives me pause for concern. You wake up and hear a bunch of whatever knocking down your door and screaming. No fire engines or flashing strobes outside. All you see is flashlights and guns coming down the hall.

What do you do?

And what happens IF the officers do have the wrong address? Then what? Now you've got officers in your home illegally with weapons.

I don't know what kind of intel and surveillance is being done before No Knocks are issued, but really needs to be of the highest quality and order.



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February 14, 2011, 07:07 PM

Right on the money.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scorpion9R View Post
Exactly - thats why when someone is applying for a warrant, at least around here, they are a TON of questions the judges ask about the location before they even issue out the warrant..


I forgot to add - a lot of times, suspects mouths get them in a lot of trouble..People start showing off to the whole block..spouting off.."I aint going down like that!" or "No MFers are taking my shit..I got something for em!" - Pistol whipping everyone on the block...etc..Well, heres a news flash for them...if you say that kinda crap, DONT BE SUPRISED IF YOUR DOOR GETS TAKEN OFF THE HINGES BY A BIG GYAT DAMN RAM.


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February 14, 2011, 07:08 PM

"I don't know what kind of intel and surveillance is being done before No Knocks are issued, but really needs to be of the highest quality and order."


Agree.


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