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Measuring A/F ratio - DIY?
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Measuring A/F ratio - DIY? - June 9, 2008, 07:57 AM

OK, say I want to tune my bike on the street instead of using a dyno. Maybe I want to do both in the long run for comparisons sake. Assume I already have a way to measure the performance of the bike through acceleration.

Now say I want to measure A/F ratio in realtime, and output that data through a serial port or equivalent. Has anyone done this? Any links to the sensor?

Last edited by LooseTooth; June 9, 2008 at 08:10 AM..
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June 9, 2008, 08:08 AM

wideband O2 sensor...and its A/F ratio... you got it backwards

also tunning on the street = lame

do it for real, do it correctly...do it on a dyno


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June 9, 2008, 08:14 AM

Some people swear by tuning on the streets. I realize dyno tune is the majority winner. I'd like to hear arguments for each side.

Street tuning - ram air effects are captured

Dyno tuning - a more direct (and perhaps more precise...) measurement of power

what else?
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June 9, 2008, 08:14 AM

thanks for the correction
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June 9, 2008, 08:30 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by LooseTooth
Some people swear by tuning on the streets. I realize dyno tune is the majority winner. I'd like to hear arguments for each side.

Street tuning - ram air effects are captured

Dyno tuning - a more direct (and perhaps more precise...) measurement of power

what else?
This is why large fans are used on dynos
street tuning is very non consistent + there is no place where you will be within VA/MD/DC legality while tuning.

dynos are consistent, safe, reliable and easy to see various aspects and by more than 1 set of eyes.

street is limited people, limited view, inconsistent runs


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June 9, 2008, 08:40 AM

If you're tuning to get every last HP out of your set up and you're not racing, it's expensive and pointless.


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June 9, 2008, 08:56 AM

Dyno will get you majority of the way there. But real world tuning is where its at for that last little bit. I'd go that route if you've already done everything else including dropped about as much weight as you could off of YOU and YOUR BIKE. I picked up an Innovate LM1 & LMA3. Among other things it records a/f ratio PER RPM, PER GEAR. Thats whats up. Tuning as best as possible in the real world means many passes in multiple gears to see what the bike wants and likes best THAT DAY. But its harder, and only a handful of roads in the area can offer enough room for big bikes to do that.


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June 9, 2008, 08:17 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by shiphteey
I picked up an Innovate LM1 & LMA3.
Well, this led me to what I was looking for: The Bosch LSU 4.2 O2 sensor. And unfortunately, this will not give me what I'm looking for without a rather complicated circuit. It has a 6 wire harness and among other things needs closed-loop control of it's internal heater. The sensor outputs would need filtering and amplification as full swing on the O2 concentration is about 0.1V. The data sheet (as usual..) is rather cryptic as well.

http://www.ontronic.com/products/doc/Bosch_LSU_4_2.pdf

Measuring acceleration through a combined accelerometer / GPS reading and recording that along with O2 information (if it was easily obtainable) and possibly data from the TPS (not sure what form this is...) would not be that big a deal for me to do. But running the LSU 4.2 is a project in itself that I'm not sure I'm willing to undertake (unless I thought I could make some $$$).

Then it seems as though I'm going down the road of stand-alone engine control and I might as well be characterizing every other sensor on the bike. I'm not actually an electrical engineer, so I think this would take me about a year and quite possibly at least one blown engine. Then I would have a tuneable ECU for the 08 ZX-10 which nobody would even buy. Just thinking out loud.
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June 9, 2008, 08:21 PM

The Bazzaz FI modules are made to do this.
http://www.bazzazperformance.com/

This is what I'll be putting on my CBR as soon as I can get my hands on it.


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June 9, 2008, 08:26 PM

I've read a little about the Bazzaz on zx-10r.net. What does it really have over the power commander? It costs about $150 more.
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June 9, 2008, 08:37 PM

It allows you to adjust the A/F ratio per gear and rpm. With the A/F sensor it will create a closed loop system and record the ratio while you ride. You can then download the data and make adjustments to the map and then upload the new map. Still not quite to the point of instantaneous on-the-fly mapping to conditions. They need a faster computer for that.


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June 9, 2008, 08:53 PM

Well damn I just ordered the PC today. I'm sure I can sell it and move to the Bazzaz in the future if I feel the need to. It seems like a cool little unit.
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June 9, 2008, 08:55 PM

the bazzaz stuff will also let you tune the map in 500 rpm incriments in each gear for a more complete tune. from what i understand about the dynojet stuff your changes per rpm cell are applied to every gear. the bazzaz system will also let you change ignition timing w/o additional "modules", same with their quickshifter. traction control, quickshifter, multi map switch, etc.. they all plug in to the main module. you then activate and tune each module.


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June 9, 2008, 09:07 PM

They could really use some more information on their site. Maybe I'm just looking hard enough. I want to know more about the base models ability to control the ignition.

The 'self mapping' funtionality is along the lines of what I had envisioned, which is just short of the ideal setup that SVbadguy touched on (closed loop mapping).

http://www.bazzazperformance.com/ind...d=15&Itemid=37
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June 9, 2008, 09:13 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scot
If you're tuning to get every last HP out of your set up and you're not racing, it's expensive and pointless.
+1
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