DCSportbikes.net  
» Help Support .NET!
DCSportbikes Premier Membership for 25$ per year. Discounts! Click here for full information.

Now available in the .NET Shop:



Get your DCSBN Gear!
» Shoutbox
Sorry, only registered users have the ability to use our real-time shoutbox to chat with other members.

Register now, it's free!
» Online Users: 516
2 members and 514 guests
beatle, nootherids
Most users ever online was 4,519, September 2, 2015 at 03:26 AM.
Go Back   DCSportbikes.net > Sportbike Operation > Tech Questions

Reply
LinkBack Thread Tools
sv peeps: need some help to determine if my girl's braking system is demon possessed
Unread
  (#1)
isn't camping great?!?!
 
shift's Avatar
 
Posts: 783
Join Date: September 19, 2005
sv peeps: need some help to determine if my girl's braking system is demon possessed - May 16, 2014, 02:59 PM

so, ever since my girl got her '06 sv, the brakes have been less than spectacular. i put galfer superbike lines on it and rebuilt the calipers last spring and it seemed to work decent for a few months. apparently, her master cylinder was on recall and the defect caused her to wash the front on buttonwillow in cali. so, we put a r1 master cylinder on it and it felt better. not great, but better.

i was coaching at ncbike and ran her bike the first morning and then all day the second day. during the day, the front brakes faded to a worthless device for me. literally, i was coaching using rear brake and engine braking the last 2 rotations. luckily, ncbike has no real hard braking zones like vir north, etc...

so we sourced a r6r radial master cylinder from a salvage shop. looks to be in good condition, not sun faded anodization or anything. i also rebuilt the calipers again, this time not using the supplied red grease with the kit. i found it dried up crusty and wondered how much that contributed to the poor performance of the system.

put the r6r master on the bike with the galfer lines and freshly redone calipers and began to refill the system and bleed the air. i got it to where air wasn't coming out of the lines late last night, but the lever still feels like crap. soft and travel close to the bar. i need to compress the calipers to dislodge any air that may be trapped in there. and i need to rebleed any air that may have risen in the system lines. i am using a bottle of motul rbf660 i opened last year.

one thing i found funny, the r1 master cylinder and the r6r master i bought were the same exact master cylinder. brembo stock equip with a 3 closer to the bleeder and a 16 closer to the lever on both.

so is it known to be a bad combo to have stock calipers with this master cylinder, is this bike demon possessed or am i missing something? other peeps in sv forum say this mc works well, but is "well" for stock sv calipers complete shit compared to stock r6 calipers? i can always get my r6 brake feel to rock hard with minimal travel with stock or aftermarket brembo mc's. makes me wonder if it's a volume flow issue with the mc. even though i heard stock uses a 14mm plunger and r6 uses a 16mm.

we are leaving for vir at 6am tomorrow and need to get this thing feeling better. so over it with this bike. thoughts appreciated...


team promotion coach #957
'o4 r6 track only - old pig in new shoes!
'o8 ktm 25o xc-w(e) street legal
'99 ktm 64o enduro a.k.a. "bad betty"
s2ooo street & track duty: volk, brembo, wilwood, ohlins ttx (soon!)


  Send a message via AIM to  
Reply With Quote
Unread
  (#2)
isn't camping great?!?!
 
shift's Avatar
 
Posts: 783
Join Date: September 19, 2005
May 16, 2014, 03:34 PM

going out now to hang some crucifixes on it and pour holy water into the radiator. if you hear a news report of lightning killing a man in ky, it was probably me. lol


team promotion coach #957
'o4 r6 track only - old pig in new shoes!
'o8 ktm 25o xc-w(e) street legal
'99 ktm 64o enduro a.k.a. "bad betty"
s2ooo street & track duty: volk, brembo, wilwood, ohlins ttx (soon!)


  Send a message via AIM to  
Reply With Quote
Unread
  (#3)
Ballaugh Bridge
 
CrazyMotorcycleGuy's Avatar
 
Posts: 6,871
Join Date: September 29, 2002
Location: VA
May 16, 2014, 03:37 PM

Bleed from the bleeder nipples and all banjo bolts.


'08 MARRC Expert Racer of the Year
2009 #3 Combined Overall Championship

  Send a message via AIM to  
Reply With Quote
Unread
  (#4)
GP Champ
 
Leoallafila's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,479
Join Date: December 15, 2010
Location: Alexandria, VA
May 16, 2014, 04:03 PM

Use a vacuum bleeder, the notorious hard to bleed rear brake on my 996 was done in 5 seconds flat, has been rock solid for months now.


2011 Ducati Diavel Chromo (Current)
2007 BMW R1200GS Adventure (Current)
2006 BMW R1200ST
2003 BMW K1200GT (Current)
2004 Ducati 998s Final Edition (Current)
1997 Aprilia RS250
1998 BMW K1200RS
2000 Ducati 998
1998 Pegaso 650
1999 Ducati 996S
2004 BMW R1150R
2005 Aprilia RSVR Factory
2001 Triumph Tiger 955i
2002 Yamaha FZ1
2006 Buell Ulysses
1991 Suzuki GSX-1100R
1991 Honda Africa Twin 750
2008 Mobster Lefty Trophy pitbike
2004 Aprilia RSVR Factory
1990 Aprilia Pegaso 125
1991 Ducati 888
1995 Honda CR250
1996 Aprilia RS125
1995 Aprilia Sr 50
1984 Kram-it 50
  Send a message via AIM to  
Reply With Quote
Unread
  (#5)
Suddenly Superstitious!!!
 
MudDawg's Avatar
 
Posts: 5,391
Join Date: August 25, 2004
Location: Dulles
May 16, 2014, 04:29 PM

And use fresh racing brake fluid. Brake fluid attracts water. So if its been open very long (Month or more) I will toss it in favor of a new bottle. Otherwise you can get fluid in the lines. Fluid + heat = possibility of bubble. Bubble = spongy and poor braking performance.

Definitely use a vacuum bleeder, makes life easier.

Have you tried a full rebuild kit top and bottom? Barring that, get some brembos and be done with it.


I want my baby back, baby back, baby back....Chileeeeee's bay back...
  Send a message via AIM to Send a message via AIM to MudDawg  
Reply With Quote
Unread
  (#6)
isn't camping great?!?!
 
shift's Avatar
 
Posts: 783
Join Date: September 19, 2005
May 16, 2014, 05:02 PM

thanks for the replies. singing kumbayah while bleeding all over seemed to help. i forgot about bleeding the banjos -- good call. got it to 95% happy. i'm getting random micro sized bubbles, esp at the master. i'll bleed the banjos and finish it off at vir tomorrow night.


team promotion coach #957
'o4 r6 track only - old pig in new shoes!
'o8 ktm 25o xc-w(e) street legal
'99 ktm 64o enduro a.k.a. "bad betty"
s2ooo street & track duty: volk, brembo, wilwood, ohlins ttx (soon!)


  Send a message via AIM to  
Reply With Quote
Unread
  (#7)
isn't camping great?!?!
 
shift's Avatar
 
Posts: 783
Join Date: September 19, 2005
May 16, 2014, 05:04 PM

i don't have a vacuum bleeder. i have always used a mix miser syringe to push/pull fluid through the lines. typically, it works pretty damn good. can anyone recommend a good vacuum bleeder? never used one.


team promotion coach #957
'o4 r6 track only - old pig in new shoes!
'o8 ktm 25o xc-w(e) street legal
'99 ktm 64o enduro a.k.a. "bad betty"
s2ooo street & track duty: volk, brembo, wilwood, ohlins ttx (soon!)


  Send a message via AIM to  
Reply With Quote
Unread
  (#8)
GP Champ
 
windblown's Avatar
 
Posts: 3,953
Join Date: June 17, 2006
Location: Shenandoah Valley, VA
May 16, 2014, 05:08 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by shift View Post
i don't have a vacuum bleeder. i have always used a mix miser syringe to push/pull fluid through the lines. typically, it works pretty damn good. can anyone recommend a good vacuum bleeder? never used one.
I picked up whatever they had at Autozone. Works fine.

Also - After you have it as good as you can get it you could try the old trick of pulling the brake handle and tie wrap it to the clipon overnight to keep it under pressure. I'm not sure why this works but it does seem to improve the feel a bit.


There's bold riders and old riders, but damn few bold old riders.
  Send a message via AIM to  
Reply With Quote
Unread
  (#9)
GP Champ
 
Leoallafila's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,479
Join Date: December 15, 2010
Location: Alexandria, VA
May 16, 2014, 05:12 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by windblown View Post
I picked up whatever they had at Autozone. Works fine.

Also - After you have it as good as you can get it you could try the old trick of pulling the brake handle and tie wrap it to the clipon overnight to keep it under pressure. I'm not sure why this works but it does seem to improve the feel a bit.
it only pushes the gaskets forward, by the time you use the brakes 3 times that effect is gone


2011 Ducati Diavel Chromo (Current)
2007 BMW R1200GS Adventure (Current)
2006 BMW R1200ST
2003 BMW K1200GT (Current)
2004 Ducati 998s Final Edition (Current)
1997 Aprilia RS250
1998 BMW K1200RS
2000 Ducati 998
1998 Pegaso 650
1999 Ducati 996S
2004 BMW R1150R
2005 Aprilia RSVR Factory
2001 Triumph Tiger 955i
2002 Yamaha FZ1
2006 Buell Ulysses
1991 Suzuki GSX-1100R
1991 Honda Africa Twin 750
2008 Mobster Lefty Trophy pitbike
2004 Aprilia RSVR Factory
1990 Aprilia Pegaso 125
1991 Ducati 888
1995 Honda CR250
1996 Aprilia RS125
1995 Aprilia Sr 50
1984 Kram-it 50
  Send a message via AIM to  
Reply With Quote
Unread
  (#10)
SaS
Sas pronounced Sauce.
 
SaS's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,562
Join Date: August 13, 2008
Location: In the city
May 16, 2014, 05:16 PM

Brake Bleeder and Vacuum Pump Kit
  Send a message via AIM to  
Reply With Quote
Unread
  (#11)
isn't camping great?!?!
 
shift's Avatar
 
Posts: 783
Join Date: September 19, 2005
May 16, 2014, 05:41 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by windblown View Post
I picked up whatever they had at Autozone. Works fine.

Also - After you have it as good as you can get it you could try the old trick of pulling the brake handle and tie wrap it to the clipon overnight to keep it under pressure. I'm not sure why this works but it does seem to improve the feel a bit.

ok, thanks james. i'll check those out.

i do the zip tie trick too. after sitting overnight, all the bubbles in the lines rise to the fitting at the master cylinder. by releasing the zip tie, you allow the fluid going back into the master cylinder to bring the air out of the lines where it can be bled from the mc. at least that is what i think happens. lol


team promotion coach #957
'o4 r6 track only - old pig in new shoes!
'o8 ktm 25o xc-w(e) street legal
'99 ktm 64o enduro a.k.a. "bad betty"
s2ooo street & track duty: volk, brembo, wilwood, ohlins ttx (soon!)


  Send a message via AIM to  
Reply With Quote
Unread
  (#12)
Air-Cooled Goodness
 
Desmo's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,007
Join Date: August 31, 2010
Location: Alexandria
May 16, 2014, 09:47 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by shift View Post
ok, thanks james. i'll check those out.

i do the zip tie trick too. after sitting overnight, all the bubbles in the lines rise to the fitting at the master cylinder. by releasing the zip tie, you allow the fluid going back into the master cylinder to bring the air out of the lines where it can be bled from the mc. at least that is what i think happens. lol
It also helps if you put the zip tie on when the bike is in the trailer. All the bumps and vibrations on the ride down will help to work those air bubbles up to the MC.


-Tommy
  Send a message via AIM to  
Reply With Quote
Unread
  (#13)
isn't camping great?!?!
 
shift's Avatar
 
Posts: 783
Join Date: September 19, 2005
May 16, 2014, 10:02 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Desmo View Post
It also helps if you put the zip tie on when the bike is in the trailer. All the bumps and vibrations on the ride down will help to work those air bubbles up to the MC.
true true...

so, one issue conquered, now the motherf@(!3r is dripping some fuel at what looks like a fuel rail. seems to stop once warmed up. f me...


team promotion coach #957
'o4 r6 track only - old pig in new shoes!
'o8 ktm 25o xc-w(e) street legal
'99 ktm 64o enduro a.k.a. "bad betty"
s2ooo street & track duty: volk, brembo, wilwood, ohlins ttx (soon!)


  Send a message via AIM to  
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
vBulletin Skin developed by: vBStyles.com
All logos and trademarks in this site are property of their respective owner. The comments are property of their posters, all the rest 2002-2010 by DCSportbikes.net. DCSportbikes.net is owned by End of Time Studios, LLC.